AOE3 Forums

Hi,

I'm wondering if you choose to have FF strategy then it means you invested everything in economy and nothing in units. So unless you opponent doing the same thing he knows that you have nothing right when game informs that you reach Fortress age.

Regardless of what units you might be able to ship and create it still be much less then your opponent who was creating units in Colonial and shipping them all this time.

How do you expect this strategy to work if you faced with probably 40+ men army when all you have is advanced age?

because fortress age shipments and units are so much better...

gs:

because fortress age shipments and units are so much better...

But the problem is that you need first available shipments  and secondly wait for them to arrive. Your opponent knows about this and pretty sure will hang out around the base to kill TC or Fortress wagon. Otherwise 1shipment available will not stand against opponent who invested everything in his army during this time. 

artisticcheese:

gs:

because fortress age shipments and units are so much better...

But the problem is that you need first available shipments  and secondly wait for them to arrive. Your opponent knows about this and pretty sure will hang out around the base to kill TC or Fortress wagon. Otherwise 1shipment available will not stand against opponent who invested everything in his army during this time. 

alright, try doing that vs one of GS's FFs and see what happens... 

SunilD93:

artisticcheese:

gs:

because fortress age shipments and units are so much better...

But the problem is that you need first available shipments  and secondly wait for them to arrive. Your opponent knows about this and pretty sure will hang out around the base to kill TC or Fortress wagon. Otherwise 1shipment available will not stand against opponent who invested everything in his army during this time. 

 

alright, try doing that vs one of GS's FFs and see what happens... 

I tried FF and was always overpowered by mass army rolling in. If I managed to get Fortress shipped and built first then I was able to recover but it usually sieged to death before it's even build. Shipping anything (8 halbs, 9 Ruyter, 8 skirmishers) does not help since colonial units of my opponent will always overpower them.

I understand it works somehow for a lot of people I just don't see what am I doing wrong. It appears the only way to survive is to expect my opponent not to attack me right after I aged up.

artisticcheese:

gs:

because fortress age shipments and units are so much better...

But the problem is that you need first available shipments  and secondly wait for them to arrive. Your opponent knows about this and pretty sure will hang out around the base to kill TC or Fortress wagon. Otherwise 1shipment available will not stand against opponent who invested everything in his army during this time. 

Firstly, most FF strats take the "available shipment" into account, and they have a shipment available either right before or right after they hit Age3.

Secondly, like goodspeed said, Age3 shipments are good.

As soon as someone hits Age3, you have to move your army.. Then your army has to attack their TC/houses/eco.

-They already have a shipment on the way. (2 cannons, or 9uhlans, or 8 skirms + 3 uhlans, or maybe 5 Lancers, Jeagers, Lands, Black Riders, etc.)

-They have minutemen.

-They have TC fire.

-Some civs will have at least 1 tower.

-They will have their "age up" shipment. (Pikes, Xbows/Pikes, Muskets, 6 Skirmishers, etc)

-They may have a Rax or Stable with upgraded units being produced.

So.. I'll give you an example of a German FF, and this is actually rather weak on defense:

6 Skirmishers (from age up)

6 Minute Men (at the same time as my shipment arrives)

12 Jeagers OR 10 Lands OR 9 Black Riders

2 Uhlans

TC fire

That alone will stuff most rushes.. Another option would be:

10+ skirmishers being produced from Rax

9 Upgraded Uhlans from shipment, or 8skirms+3 uhlans, or 5 Dopps, etc.

2-4 upgraded Uhlans from previous shipments.

6 Minute Men

6 Skirmishers from Age

~5 Uhlans being produced from Stabs

In any case.. Your rush will not stand up to it.

 If you want an example of how it works I'll play you an unrated game where I do a Naked FF, and you spend your Age2 time massing up military. As soon as I hit age3, you rush me. You'll be surprised at how quickly you're forced to fall back.

artisticcheese:

SunilD93:

alright, try doing that vs one of GS's FFs and see what happens... 

I tried FF and was always overpowered by mass army rolling in. If I managed to get Fortress shipped and built first then I was able to recover but it usually sieged to death before it's even build. Shipping anything (8 halbs, 9 Ruyter, 8 skirmishers) does not help since colonial units of my opponent will always overpower them.

I understand it works somehow for a lot of people I just don't see what am I doing wrong. It appears the only way to survive is to expect my opponent not to attack me right after I aged up.

Forts arnt everything bud, not a greta shipment if ur being attacked that moment. Mike 2 connon maybe?if the rusher rushed with inf, like most 1st lt and lower would, then ur gonna pwn if u get lsome other nits rolling in, u gotta build stables/rax during age-up, maybe before...

 Just read some good streats on HG, and learn to adjust to whats happening.

So if you are german and you just hit Fortress. You have 2 Uhlans from colonial shipment and 6 skirmishers and minuteman which will be useless in 30 or seconds. You shipped mercenaries which will take 40 s or so to arrive and will also cost your gold.

I was massing army all this time as your opponent. So I for example can have 10 colonial Hussars and 10 pikeman and 6 xbows. So even before you first shipment arrives you'll loose all your army and probably some villagers and economy will stop progressing becouse all settlers probably will be stationed in TC.

I'm talking about playing in my own rank I understand better ranks have better macroing skills and probably will be able to minimize their losses but still FF army will be overpowered in this case.

I never rush so I never experienced how I can win in this situation but I'm frequently rushed and I was neer been able to do FF and survive on shipments alone.

artisticcheese:

So if you are german and you just hit Fortress. You have 2 Uhlans from colonial shipment and 6 skirmishers and minuteman which will be useless in 30 or seconds. You shipped mercenaries which will take 40 s or so to arrive and will also cost your gold.

I was massing army all this time as your opponent. So I for example can have 10 colonial Hussars and 10 pikeman and 6 xbows. So even before you first shipment arrives you'll loose all your army and probably some villagers and economy will stop progressing becouse all settlers probably will be stationed in TC.

I'm talking about playing in my own rank I understand better ranks have better macroing skills and probably will be able to minimize their losses but still FF army will be overpowered in this case.

I never rush so I never experienced how I can win in this situation but I'm frequently rushed and I was neer been able to do FF and survive on shipments alone.

6 Skirmishers + 6 Minute Men + TC fire + 2 Uhlans > 10 Pikes 10 Hussars and 6 Xbows.

And even if you don't kill every single unit, your Fort shipment should arrive while fighting is still taking place, and they will lose their colonial army... Then you have the XP (or soon will) for another shipment, which then proceeds to harass and counter-attack.

As I said, I can show you how it's done.

micro and time shipments + mm with counterattack :)

Its a FF: Fast Fortress, so if you manage to do it fast you won't have much problems.

Practice offline if you have timing problems.

Lol I just played a team game and some dude got industrial like in 9 mins and he did revolution like at 13.00.

They got owned.

esam709:

Lol I just played a team game and some dude got industrial like in 9 mins and he did revolution like at 13.00.

They got owned.

 

kewl. revs usually suck unless you're otto or spain.