AOE3 Forums

Japanese are the most OP civ there is. I mean the wonders? just insane. Ashis are way to strong, daimyos support to much, and the wonders are way to good. the golden pavilion already gives ure soldiers a boost. why should it be an advanced arsenal? hatamotos are cheap and strong. 290 export is nothing compare to their strengh. U might say russians are more OP cause they got instant HI. But u gotta admit: with only 7 barracks its ok. anyway, japanese may got kinda weak eco but their units are OP.

Lord Nikken:

man, u cant be good at macroing. i have played with japs over 30 times on treaty, and have a 80% win, which is more than any other civ im playing on treaty.

they ARE OP. of course they are.

their most OP unit however, is not the ashigarus, nor the yumis, they are after my opinion the flaming arrows, as you have the less cost and training card plus the card which makes daimyos create units twice as fast. they are very good artillery that can be trained fast, and they dont even have to switch between walking mode and firing mode.

when it comes to eco, i think its good enough. i almost never play 1vs1 on treaty, so i always have a teammate that gives me sheep or w/e to boost shrines. that is a must of course. i dont use the spanish consulate, i get my XP from shrines instead, so i have all the cards done at the end of treaty, plus 6 naginatas or samurais infinite times that will spawn from a daimyo..

its important to make consulate armies. remember that they are free.

as for me, when i play with japs, i mostly make ashis, naginatas and flaming arrows from daimyos and it works fine. if i want to, i switch to yumis, yabusames or morutaru, but i rarely make samurais..

i dont see why u think their eco is so bad. why? lack of vills? they got shrines ffs. at most, those shrines gives about 30/s in resource trickle. the dutch banks gives 2.75 each, and u can have 10 of the at max. so, in other words, FU bank and shrine trickle gives almost the same, but with japs u can choose whichever resource u want, even XP, and they have 25 more vills. i know dutch is not a good comparison since they have way to bad eco on treaty though.. but my point is anyways that the japanese have good enough economy for their OP military. thats my opinion. and yes i know what u said about hate messages or w/e

my advise on eco though, would be this

1. DONT get spies, why not get the buddha statue instead if its so important?

2. play on maps with an ally, its better than 1vs1 because your ally can give you herdables

3. get the shrine upgrades from the HC. the one which makes them cheaper and increases rates is a must, and i think the one which gives them XP trickle is good. keep the consulate at portuguese until 10-5min before treaty ends, then switch to dutch, THEN switch to jap iso..

and of course macroing vills is important.. just a practice thing..

 

just dont get it. i never run out of eco and ive never played japs with fishing boats.

dude, sorry i didnt think the topic is about treaty... since i hate treaty coz its no fun at all as u know its like wasting time... i love to play with full of excitement even from the moment before i start a game with others. so what i have talked about was about classic game actually.

yeah actually u are definitely right. jp's artillery is good as u mentioned. i absolutely agree with them, and i am happy that there is another guy who noticed the great points of flaming arrows.

but yeah, i usually use those flaming arrow for defense when i play classic game. what i meant here was that ashi is super duper insane with his range attack... so i actually dun really make yumi coz i dun wanna waste woods. and ashi is enough even against those enemy heavy inf coz 87 in 5th age... i mean range attack. its almost same as european shirmishers... but higher hitpoint. and the good points of ashi are low pop of coz, and cheap. i tend to have more foods coz of upgrade. ashi is good one to make my eco balanced anyway. so the only concern here is enemy artillery. i just needa have 5 to 10 of yabusame counter cavs. they can even beat 10 of falconets like by 5 of them... with good controlling. even if enemy pike dudes follow them, i just use them to shoot pikemen(i mean halvediers? i dunno the spell sorry) and escape, and maybe split 5 of them, if i have like 10, to beat enemy cannons. at the time, usually pikemen cannot damage anything if ur enemy controlling sucks coz all pike-men just follow 10 yabusame... lol but are beaten by ashi's while my yabusame running around ashis. even if enemy beat my ashi by cannons. as long as i have yabusame, it means i won coz they costed a lot but i just lost cheap ashis. anyways, its true that flaming arrow is awesome with its range and flexibility for shooting. in the above situation, if i have some of them, it would be much better but i like to march faster. and only the concern about flaming arrow is weaker when it comes to fighting against european artilery. i dunno, it is supporsed to be good with its pop cost and flexibility, but i usually cannot let them survive if i use them to attack enemy artilleries. once they counter, they are tougher. so i have to use yabusame for the solution.

anyway, for me, when i use japan, as long as the map is with sea, the economy is actually the greatest. this is the only country i can surpass the eco of expart computers(their eco is *** cheating) in the second age. i mean in classic, of coz, not treaty. of coz germany and china can surpass when it comes to 5th age if i really concentrate on eco but i dunno how to surpass the eco of cheating exparts' comps in the SECOND age. i usually get to 5th age within 25min even if enemy attacked me previously and at the moment, all the eco improvements are surely done. the reason is 3 boatsx2 at the first age, 5 boatsx2 in the second age, plus fish marketx2... these cards make japanese insane for early building up its eco... fish boats are the solutions to conclude jp's food concerns. and yeah, with shrines.

oh by the way, about yumi, they are crazy actually. yes, ppl would say they only have 1.5 bonus against heavy inf. but the points here are that 1. their original damage can reach to 55(55x1.5against heavy inf = 88), 2. their range is 18 (with shipment being 20). that means, coz of the original damage, when it comes to yumi vs skirmishers, yumi definitely win for sure. yumi is the best LIGHT inf against light inf...lol. and moreover, this is important. if yumi is upgraded their range, it become 20. so then yabusame smartly can be fit into the gap between ashi(12 range) and yumi(20 range). so i guess japan is organized in this way. so it just depends on how u use them but yumi can be super nice counter against enemy counter cavs with 55x1.5... so ur yabusme is always safe. i dun wanna lose them coz they are actually pretty expensive. so aoe is money war i guess? lol

Fedayeen_Hagop:

was i askin you? stop being a jackass i was jw

Lol azhole I have the right to post watever I want to

okay...? so you find it necessary to be a jackass? i didnt see you denying it at all and no i dont see myself as an *** because i didnt do anything besides stand up for myself so how about you kiss my ass okay?

I agree with your views (@topic starter) expect the one where you said russia is the biggest noob civ there is due to their economy and heavy infantry. Also Japan's eco is excellent in normal no rules-games. (I realize this is treaty)

Just pointing out that if the japanese eco was boosted even further, it would bring a huge over-powerness to japan in no rules games. And sorry to say for treaty players but I think the no rules gameplay type is still so popular a game mode that ES wouldn't go boosting japan, making it totally OP in casual games.

Also I don't think russia's army could be described as "heavy", since most of the time they spam strelets which can be turtled and defeated that way. Also the other russian units, even the heavy infantry units such as halberdiers and musks are not equally powerful to those of other civs. (again I realize this is treaty discussion)

japan poons what else is there to say??

japan is gay.

 

the consulate armies are ok i guess, but right b4 the last upgrade to imperial, whave 199 pop, what have u to lose with extra men !! the more the merrier, but i wouldnt use them unless i am at 199 pop.

http://www.agecommunity.com/stats/GameStats.aspx?loc=en-US&GameID=0fa4051f-e7f2-40e6-8001-b80f949cf73f&sFlag=2&md=ZS_Treaty

In this game my eco was fine with japan, it was as good as anyone elses and then with my OP military units on top of it i ended up killing about 2100 units and losing 1400.

You can also see how much i suck at using daiymos correctly.