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  •  02-19-2009, 12:09 AM 795098 in reply to 794933
    Finchie Finchie is not online. Last active: 30-01-2012, 11:48 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    savorybeef3:
    according to most people here gendarmes beat everything.....

    And according to me, most people on these forums are wrong. Wink

    Hanzo_Razor:

    If yr playing japo, yumi +samurais will rock those wagons and watever is hiding under there lol. Esp when u have the long range upgrade fr yumis. Its funny seeing those wagons drop away one by one and expose his army for a nag/ashi assault.

    Ofcourse! Play Japanese in DM, the slowest-training civ and the worst DM civ, to beat the one that is best at rushing!

    /sarcasm

     


    Metis:
    Finchie:

    Metis made a grammar mistake. Surprise



    Someone a while back caught me in a grammar mistake too. You now are a member of an elite club. Well done.



    HELL YES
  •  05-27-2009, 1:44 PM 814382 in reply to 795098
    dinifettimuetter dinifettimuetter is not online. Last active: 11-30-2009, 6:39 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    Ok guys, let's take a look at the stats (vanilla)

    Veteran War Wagon
           Attack:    42 ranged, ROF 3, 3x bonus vs cav
           HP:         500
           Resist:   20%, Melee

     
    Veteran Lamedier
           Attack:   30, ROF 1.5
           HP:         500
           Resist:   20%, ranged

    Let's have them FU.

    Both units get 3 cards:
           -Cavalry Combat 10%/10%
           -Cavalry Hitpoints 10%
           -Cavalry Attack 10%

    Cuirassier gets another 10% / 10% bonus for royal guard upgrade.

    Now, a non carded, Imperial War Wagon has:
           -500 + 150 + 250 HP = 900 HP
           -42 + 12.6 + 21 attack = 74 attack (rounded up)

    A non carded, Imperial Lamedarme has:
           -500+200+250 HP = 950 HP
           -30+12+15 attack = 57 attack, ROF 1.5

    So, while an Imperial War Wagon has a theoretical damage output of 74 every three seconds, a gendarme has 114. WW have 20% Melee resistance, taking in only 91.2 damage.

    Unfortunately, for the french horsie, the war wagon gets a 3x bonus against him, effectively tripling the output to 222. Lamedarmes have 20% Ranged Resistance, so they take only 178 Damage per shot.

    So, War wagons inflict almost twice the damage on gendarmes than vice versa, they cost exactly the same and thus should clearly win.

     

    But then there is lame splash damage. Other ranged cav can hit and run, war wagons theoretically could, but they're just too clumsy. Then again, I don't guess they're too much affected by splash damage,  because they already use up much space.

     

    I am not quite sure there, the splash damage makes the calculating a little difficult, but still, War Wagons should cleary win.

     

    And btw: for a dragoon type of unit, war wagons have ridiculously high siege.

     

    EDIT: Both units have the same upgrades.

    +30% extra HP, 40 on gay plains. (Cav HP, Combat, Arsenal, comanche TP)

    +20% extra Attack

     

    that evens out too. 

    EDIT 2: How much extra damage does the arsenal tech for ranged horsies give? 10%?

    EDIT 3: Depending on how many cards the frenchy and the german use to upgrade their horsies, it might take 7 war wagons or 6 war wagons to one-shot-kill one lamedarme. u certainly want to avoid having to use 7 since you can already get only 33 of them. (or worse 20, if you max out in pop)

    EDIT 4: it seems unfair that a frenchy has 99 villie eco with 80 villagers, but germans can have 89 villagers for 99 villie eco. a smart player would use 60 settlers+20 settler wagons though, for a 10% bonus in economy (my opinion)




    G0D is a noob and probably french, so I hit him with a stick too.
  •  05-27-2009, 1:54 PM 814389 in reply to 814382
    DarkAngel_Fin DarkAngel_Fin is not online. Last active: 08 Jan 2011, 3:11 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    Think it's 10%.

    If WWs lose to gendarmes I'm considering to quit playing. And FU doppels eat gendarmes alive. Even a small number.


    G0D:
    I am the best expert on AOE3 ever.

    StrategicJoeL:

    -ship 700 wood when your next shipment is ready. Use it to build three tradeposts and some houses.
    on *** sioux...
  •  05-27-2009, 1:55 PM 814390 in reply to 814389
    dinifettimuetter dinifettimuetter is not online. Last active: 11-30-2009, 6:39 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    FU war wagons do fairly well against gendarmes. at least cost effectively.

    Since germany has better eco anyway and both units can be spammed, guess who lives longer?

     

    And War Wagons take f'in years to die, especially in Vanilla where Ranged Infantry doesn't have a bonus vs. them. 

    EDIT: War wagons are also schweet because they can take out artillery very well.

    a veteran war wagon with 42 attack, 2x bonus vs. artillery and 0.75 ranged resistance means that 12 war wagons can kill a falconet in one shot. might seem a little bit much, since 2 culverins can do the same job, but as stated before, war wagons take years to die, culverins are flies.

    And if they melee teh falconets, it's 21 melee attack with a 2x bonus and a rate of fire of 1.5.

    So, 6 war wagons would need 3 seconds to kill one Falconet (2 shots).

    They could do it in 1.5 seconds if they COULD close in, but they can't because they're too fat. haha. At least it would need 1337 m!cr0 sk!llz




    G0D is a noob and probably french, so I hit him with a stick too.
  •  07-17-2009, 6:07 AM 827538 in reply to 814390
    vorg vorg is not online. Last active: 03-08-2010, 9:24 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    Germans cant be beaten sadly :( Also WW own cuirr. There is something called attack move.

     

    /thread :D

     

    Also you wont have all your cuirr attacking at once whilst all the ww will be all the time

  •  07-17-2009, 6:27 PM 827635 in reply to 827538
    PandaXVII PandaXVII is not online. Last active: 02 Jul 2013, 2:53 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    vorg:

    Germans cant be beaten sadly :( Also WW own cuirr. There is something called attack move.

     

    /thread :D

     

    Also you wont have all your cuirr attacking at once whilst all the ww will be all the time

    AKA Mircoing



    [23:19] MrRewindThat: i love to have a big debate with sheeps on the forums.

    My Current High
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    Deathmatch: Level 39 Brigadier
  •  07-17-2009, 6:31 PM 827638 in reply to 827635
    PandaXVII PandaXVII is not online. Last active: 02 Jul 2013, 2:53 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    When playing a RUSH dm game, spain will generally beat germany!

    I was able to beat a M. Searg german using spain in 3:22.  I was getting units @ 0:30 seconds! You will need a very good deck and will need to be very fast to pull it off!



    [23:19] MrRewindThat: i love to have a big debate with sheeps on the forums.

    My Current High
    Supremacy: Level 31 Major
    Deathmatch: Level 39 Brigadier
  •  07-17-2009, 9:25 PM 827685 in reply to 827638
    vorg vorg is not online. Last active: 03-08-2010, 9:24 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    i WIll play you 10 million times and you will not get close to beating germans with spain
  •  07-18-2009, 8:57 AM 827738 in reply to 827638
    Finchie Finchie is not online. Last active: 30-01-2012, 11:48 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    PandaXVII:

    When playing a RUSH dm game, spain will generally beat germany!

    I was able to beat a M. Searg german using spain in 3:22.  I was getting units @ 0:30 seconds! You will need a very good deck and will need to be very fast to pull it off!

    Whoaooaoaoa, a RUSH deathmatch?

    Surprise


    Metis:
    Finchie:

    Metis made a grammar mistake. Surprise



    Someone a while back caught me in a grammar mistake too. You now are a member of an elite club. Well done.



    HELL YES
  •  07-18-2009, 1:00 PM 827784 in reply to 827738
    Crazy guy Crazy guy is not online. Last active: Sun, Aug 23 2009, 8:46 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    LMAO. I think I should sigg that...

    The_Fry_Cook_of_Doom:
    I don't want my account banned. I have all my credit card details attached to this account, which means Aloysius can also steal money from my bank account and use it to watch adult videos on the internet!
  •  07-18-2009, 9:11 PM 827813 in reply to 827738
    EdyPegasus EdyPegasus is not online. Last active: 07-07-2010, 8:33 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    Finchie:
    PandaXVII:

    When playing a RUSH dm game, spain will generally beat germany!

    I was able to beat a M. Searg german using spain in 3:22.  I was getting units @ 0:30 seconds! You will need a very good deck and will need to be very fast to pull it off!

    Whoaooaoaoa, a RUSH deathmatch?

    Surprise

    The person who turtles and sets up a base while raiding the other person with only a few units will win! that is why he said DM rush.......You can instead of attacking keep the army in your base, Wall, put up towers, set up eco to actually have a chance if your attacks fail, Towers take out the enemy very fast.... esp when you have your ful military right there. That is why turtlers (5min turtle XD) win.


    The one and only. ~Pegasus~
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1D5VgRjDoI
    Україна Моя Надія
    (By the way this means Ukraine is my hope, in Ukrainian)
  •  07-18-2009, 10:28 PM 827817 in reply to 827813
    Finchie Finchie is not online. Last active: 30-01-2012, 11:48 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    EdyPegasus:
    Finchie:
    PandaXVII:

    When playing a RUSH dm game, spain will generally beat germany!

    I was able to beat a M. Searg german using spain in 3:22.  I was getting units @ 0:30 seconds! You will need a very good deck and will need to be very fast to pull it off!

    Whoaooaoaoa, a RUSH deathmatch?

    Surprise

    The person who turtles and sets up a base while raiding the other person with only a few units will win! that is why he said DM rush.......You can instead of attacking keep the army in your base, Wall, put up towers, set up eco to actually have a chance if your attacks fail, Towers take out the enemy very fast.... esp when you have your ful military right there. That is why turtlers (5min turtle XD) win.

    If you've ever played dm before against a player above PR 15, you should know that nobody turtles in deathmatch, unless they want to lose.


    Metis:
    Finchie:

    Metis made a grammar mistake. Surprise



    Someone a while back caught me in a grammar mistake too. You now are a member of an elite club. Well done.



    HELL YES
  •  07-18-2009, 10:56 PM 827823 in reply to 789631
    MUZZIES MUZZIES is not online. Last active: 10-13-2009, 10:20 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    Neverseperat:
    try french and voltiguers

    French cruis. or japs merc. Samuria (well i guess they dominate anywhere) Stick out tongue


    Canada the true north, strong and free

    A Canadian North wind cuts u down

    We have to wait till spring to Bury YOU
  •  07-18-2009, 10:57 PM 827824 in reply to 789631
    MUZZIES MUZZIES is not online. Last active: 10-13-2009, 10:20 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...

    Neverseperat:
    try french and voltiguers

    French cruis. or japs merc. Samuria (well i guess they dominate anywhere) Stick out tongue


    Canada the true north, strong and free

    A Canadian North wind cuts u down

    We have to wait till spring to Bury YOU
  •  07-18-2009, 11:44 PM 827830 in reply to 793106
    AzureRebellion AzureRebellion is not online. Last active: 04-16-2011, 8:14 PM
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    Subject: Re: how do i defeat the germans...
    No. Do not use cuirs. I forget the multiplier but it is insane versus cav. Even though war wagons are very good they are hardy used in any of the games ive played. Use skirms and halbs. Maybe some musks if you wish. The only time someone has used war wagons against me was the only time Im pretty sure i lost to a german. They are very good.
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