Well, as title says, I made this thread to discuss about balacing units, I will make suggestions for a lot of units, so I will just divide my suggestions into sections here are my current ideas:
Cavalry:
Cuirrassier: Since many people complained about this unit in this thread, I decided to add it too...
My suggestion:
Pretty obvious, make em have colonial stats, the stats would be this ones:
417 HP and 25 attack. So in fortress they get 500 HP and 30 attack, but in imperial when F.U. they will have less HP and Attack tahn they do now, since the upgrades affect the stats of the cuirr, lower stats = upgrades arent so good and cuirrs arent so OP.
Oprichniks- This guys are too good overall, apart from being great raiders, they can greatly fight vs such units as artillery or siege troopers. This guys are a bit OP if we compare em with other cavalry, if you think that this guys are fine, then please say it, and I will make a decent comparison to cossacks.
My suggestion:
Decrease their attack to 15, and their HP to 225. Increase their bonus to villagers to 4 from 3.
Mamelukes- This guys got nerfed to industrial age, but why? just because they cost 400 gold? thats an incredibly unfair change, since if you compare this guys to Li'l Bombards and to elmetis, they arent so good as people think... And also, you can already get em in age 3 by some cards, make em train in age 4 when you can get em in age 3 its a bit stupid, dont you think so?
Also, if you think that this guys shouldnt be boosted, I can compare to stradiots, if you want to.
My suggestion:
Move em to fortress.
Elmetis: I think that this guys are too good overall, and need a little nerf. Their multiplier to infantry have got a great value, and this guys are quite powerfull.
My suggestion:
Decrease their attack to 35 from 40.
Jat Lancers: This guys are basically like elmetis, but are a bit more UP... Compare em to elmetis and you will see that I am right. The fact that they make incredibly more damge to infantry, isnt a back up that they make less damage to other units and have 40% HP less. Even having more speed than elmetis, speed isnt that usefull for heavy cavalry, since heavy cav already got speed, only thing good of speed for heavy cav, its that with more speed, harder they are microed by light cav, and they can read easier. However its not that great for the bad bonuses of this unit.
My suggestion:
Increase their Attack to 45 from 35, but decrease their HP to 525 from 600. Move em to age 4. I think that my suggestion mostly sucks, if it does, I would like that you could suggest a better one, and prove why do this one sucks.
Rifle riders: OK, sioux arent so good anymore, apparently this guys are the only thing they got, but, I think that they need to get nerfed, and the civ sioux overall get boosted, I think that that change would be good, I would give my suggestions to sioux civ, but I made this thread its to discuss unit balance, not civ balance.
My suggestion:
Either increase its ROF to 3.0 from 1.5 and incease its attack to 15,
or just decrease its attack from 13 to 8.
This changes may sound extreme, but are fair consdering the fact that rifle riders counter heavy infantry, got an incredible bonus to artillery, and got a ROF of 1.5. This unit got tons of great bonuses, and its multipliers really help it, and it can easily fight to its own counter.
Sowar: I guess what you must be thinking now, India is already a top 3 Civ, many people consider it the OPest civ at the moment, and they dont need a boost. But this units are UP, and need a boost, nerfing India and boosting a few of their units are different things, as in a similar case with sioux, I suggest to boost sowars, but to also nerf India in some way.
My Suggestion:
Increase the attack of this units in a 25% as minimum, and a 50% as maximum, to a number between 25-30, cant be sure though,, this may be a bit extreme, but its fair considering the fact that they cost 2 pop and 160 resources. However, the value of 1.5 to RI its quite good, but it isnt enough back up for this unit, read comparison with cossacks and nagis that I did at ends of this thread.
Siege Elephant: Ditto sowars.
My suggestion:
increase their bonus to artillery to 3.5, their range 30, and their attack to 45. I know that here what I said was just too simple, And I didnt gave a simple reason or comparison, but I think that everyone would agree this change, since this units actually are UP, and make quite little damage to artillery. Even being great against buildings.
Zamburaks: I consider this guys fine overall, the only thing I dont like, its the fact that lately some upgrades give em a bonus to artillery, making em a bit OP. This is OP considering the fact that this guys got a card that already gives em a bonus to artillery, and the fact that they got a very high bonus to heavy cav. Also, many people still think that zams are OP.
My suggestion:
The upgrades of zamburaks no more increase a bonus to artillery, it just affects HP and attack, as every upgrade else.
Outlaws:
Pistoleros- Pretty obvious lol, this guys cost 5 pop, have got just 1 upgrade, havent got instant fire, and train a bit slow, for all this negative bonuses, this guys just got 30% attack more than a musk.
My suggestion:
Increase their HP to 200, their meele attack to 15, and their ranged attack to 32.
Renegados- Well, as other outlaws, cost a lot of pop, have got just 1 upgrade, havent got instant fire, and train a bit slow. Even though, 40 attack is enough for em, but they need a very little boost more.
My suggestion:
Increase their HP to 130.
Outlaw rider- I think its not necessary to repeat this, pop, instant fire, slow training, etc...
My suggestion:
Increase their attack from 16 to 23.
Pirate- Ditto I said previously of all outlaws.
My suggestion:
Increase their attack from 12 to 16.
Wokuo Pirate- ditto I said previously of all outlaws.
My suggestion:
Increase their speed to 5.5, their attack to 18, and their HP to 180.
Wokuo Ronin- The only difference that this outlaws got to the others, its that this ones are very expensive, but however their stats are fine...
My suggestion:
Decrease their cost to 150 gold, increase their attack to 30, and their HP to 450.
Dacoit Marathan- Probably the most balanced outlaw, but I would like a very little boost
My Suggestion:
Add 10 more HP.
Wokuo Blind Monk- ditto every outlaw...
My Suggestion:
Increase their attack to 21, and their HP to 135.
Wokuo Horseman- Ditto every other outlaw...
My suggestion
Decrease their train time to 50, increase their attack to 26, increase their HP to 360.
Infantry:
Spies: This guys got a completely not necessary bonus to native warriors, apart from being just x4.0 that makes their attack vs em just 20, its completely not necessary, consdering the fact that natives are arleady rarely used, since their limit is too low. And you cant really mass em.
And also as you seen previously, I am kinda overboosting outlaws, so lets turn the multiplier spies got vs natives make it vs outlaws.
My suggestion:
Delete The bonus spies got vs natives, and instead of it, give em 1 vs outlaws, 1 of x10.0, so people wont mass this outlaws a lot. Make this boost also affect ninjas and consulate ninjas.
Flamethrowers: This guys are good, but got a serious problem, they got just 10 of range, even muskeeters got a higher range than just that. And also, this guys work as artillery, but apperently are classified as infantry and siege troopers. People get confused with this, and they are like "wtf" when they make culverins that got pretty owned by flamethrowers
My suggestion:
Increase their speed to 4.5, and make their RR be now 75%. Give em an artillery classifier, and make em no long have an infantry and ranged infantry one. Nerf their negative bonus to cav to 0.7.
Cassadors: When people compare this guys to skirmishers, they say both are balanced, but are always confused with the fact that this units got a fortress stat, and not a colonial one.
My suggestion:
This guys no longer are veteran cassadors, now they are just cassadors, having colonial stats.. With this change they will be a bit OP, so I suggest to decrease their HP to 90 too if the change I suggested is done, so the stats would be this ones:
90 HP, 17 attack, and 50% RR
Bolas warrior: This guys are fine, consdering the fact that they got a splash ranged attack, the problem is that they make just a pathetic 8 of damage. And also are archers and have 3.0 ROF. Even most archers having 1.5.
My suggestion:
Change their ROF to 1.5, but increase their cost to 70 food and 45 wood.
Aennas: This guys are pretty good, considering the fact that they cost pure food and got a lot of upgrades (cards) in colonial, not even including the HP aura their explorer got. I think that they got overboosted, if you want you can 1vs1 em with cetan bows, but remember that cetan bows cost wood and havent got a lot of upgrades, and still it will be a draw (both units will die).
My suggestion:
Decrease their HP to 100, and their attack to 11 or 10.
Tomahawks: Since I have suggested a nerf to aennas, and iros arent a completely OP or even balanced civ, and this guys are weaker than musk, I suggest to boost em, even though my boost is very little
My suggestion:
Increase their attack to 22.
Ashigarus: This guys are still a bit OP after patch, since you can get 46 or 45 attack with em in colonial age. 5% nerf in ashigaru card of attack wasnt a lot.
My Suggestion:
A main reason this guys are OP in colonial, are the advanced arsenal upgrades they got with golden pavillion. Golden pavillion is already 1 of the most OP (probably the most OP) wonders in this game. I suggest to make their advanced arsenal upgrades unavailable untill you get to fortress. But also boost the number of yumis you get in colonial with this wonder.
Make the card attack of ashigarus now give 20% as it was before the 1.01 patch, its balanced considering the fact that other attack cards of other civs attack 2 units giving both 15% attack boost, this just affects 1 unit.
Grenadier: When milo said that "We couldnt boost this unit because we havent got enough time when we designed this patch" in a patch discussion, I laughed so hard... principally because it was the longest patch ever done (it took like 6-7 months), and it didnt even fixed bugs of scenarios. But its better make a boost late than never...
My suggestion: This guys are no longer classified as heavy infantry, they are now ranged infantry, this will be a great change with em, since this will allow em to dont be countered with its own counter, because skirmishers and archers got a bonus vs em, and they are supposed to counter em.
Arsonist: This unit its just like the grenadier...
My suggestion:
Increase their attack to 35, and make em no longer be classified as heavy infantry, just ranged infantry.
Artillery:Gatling guns: I hate when ES boosts a unit (such as organ gun in patch 1.04 of TWC), but dont boosts its clone, example, when they boost an organ gun, they should boost a gatling gun too, when they nerf xbows, they should nerf consulate xbows too, etc... I would like that ES would boost the clone of the unit they are nerfing/boosting in a patch.
My suggestion:
Add gatlings a multiplier of 0.75 to buildings.
Flying crows: This guys are quite UP if we consider the fact that just 1 wonder can build em and that wonder takes 4 mins to build 1 of em...
My suggestion:
Make the confucious make flying crows faster: When you build this wonder in colonial age, you can get 1 of this guys each 200 seconds. When you build it in fortress, 1 of this guys each 160 seconds, when in industrial, 1 of this guys each 110 seconds, when in imperial, 1of this guys each 60 seconds.
Also make em no longer have a negative multiplier to cavalry. And boost their attack to 200, and their HP to 300.
War ships:
Fire junk: This guys do needs a boost, consdering the fact that it dies too fast, and it can be killed before it gets its objective. Example, 2 fire junks cost like 1 caravel, 2 fire junks can kill 1 caravel, but they die too, but a caravel can also fish, and transport units, and have broadside attack, and attacks tons of times. A fire junk can be just trained fast and then die.
My suggestion:
Boost their attack to 700 from 500.
Catamaran Marathas: This ships are fine, the only problem, its that why they fish, this guys shouldnt fish, since they got just an outlaw there without anything that can fish that also attacks other ships or units. i mean, how would the outlaw fish without the necessary thing to do it.
My suggestion:
This guys no longer can fish, but also, their ranged attack is boosted 20.
Well, I hope that you agree with my suggestions, I really worked a lot to make this post.
Discuss plz.
LAST EDIT ON 06/04/08 4:00 p.m.